Dizzy lost thread

[Tinster]

Our dizzy thread got accidentally deleted.
I lost much of the info. that was posted.
I need the tail end posts again to attempt
to start the Crypt car.

Current Crypt car status:

Installed as on Sunday:New dizzy, new electronic ignition
(new points as spare)new cap, new plug wires, new plugs,
new battery, all new Dan Masters Power bloc wiring harness,
new ignition switch.

Piston No.1 is for sure TDC now.

I bought those feeler thickness fingers and set the
spark plug gaps and with Bentley gave it my best shot
at adjusting the 12 valves. I Ordered two new valve cover gaskets and a new fuel pump.

I got two new dizzy mounting bolts and torqued down the
unit ay No.1 TDC. I noticed the bolts went thru slots which
allowed some movement in position. Are these timing
adjustment screws?

Bill- What was that gasket goop you told me to use?
I had already figured I would use clothes pins to hold
it in place.

Now a curiosity of sorts.

The Crypt car ran for maybe ten to 15 minutes total
before it died. I had just managed to get the new carbs
to a flucuating rough idle at between around 900 to 1200,
if I recall.

Yesterday when I gapped the plugs: No1, 2 and 3 were nice
light tan. No 4, 5 and 6 were carbon black and greasy to
the point I cleaned them with 600 grit emory paper.

The new carbs are not yet tuned, I was first trying to
get a constant idle when the car died. Any suggestions what
I might do to the carbs before I try to crank up the Crypt car in a week or so?

Sorry for the long post, much to relate today.

thanks as always,

dale /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grouphug.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grouphug.gif

 

[Guest]

U need a Pair of New Overalls, Son!
/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jester.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jester.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/jester.gif

 

[Harry_Ward]

Dale,

If firing order from front of engine is 1-5-3-6-2-4 you mean the plugs at cylinder numbers 1-5-3 ok and 6-2-4 black?
If so this would indicate the rear carb feeding those cylinders is running rich and needs to be leaned out. However you don't really want to fool with that until you at least get your cap on and get it running because you don't know if those cylinders were getting the correct spark to begin with.

 

[Brosky]

I agree again with Harry. Get it running first, then tweak carbs well after warm up is done and timing is set as close as possible.

Regarding the dizzy adjustment bolts, do you have the side clamp tightened down yet? You should leave it just snug until timing is adjusted after warm up with idle as close to 900 rpm as possible.

Give us a picture of your distributor installation so we can make sure everything is there and in place properly.

Let's try to take this one step at a time so that you can control the process without too many variables.

And let's keep it all on one thread so as to not get off track. We'll be able to keep issues that may develop in context to one another much better this way.

 

[swift6]

[ QUOTE ]
Dale,

If firing order from front of engine is 1-5-3-6-2-4 you mean the plugs at cylinder numbers 1-5-3 ok and 6-2-4 black?

[/ QUOTE ]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nonod.gif The front carb feed cylinders 1-2-3 (the front half of the engine), the rear carb feeds cylinders 4-5-6 (the rear half of the engine). Cylinders numbers are in numeric order in the engine,(1 at the front, 6 at the rear).

Firing order is established at the distributor, as the rotor spins in an anti-clockwise direction. From firing cyl#1 to cyl#5 to cyl#3 to cyl#6 to cyl#2 to cyl#4 then back to cyl#1 as it completes its rotation.

Cylinders #1 and #3 are the only cylinders to match their firing order. Otherwise, cylinder #2 is the fifth (5th) to fire but cylinder #5 is the second (2nd) to fire. Cylinder #4 is the sixth (6th) to fire while cylinder #6 is the fourth (4th) to fire.

If cylinders 4,5&6 are black and sooty though, yes that would indicate a rich mixture from the rear carb.

 

[Harry_Ward]

Dale, you and Shawn got the cylinder numbers right I was thinking with my wierd Monday work brain at the time I guess?

 

[swift6]

[ QUOTE ]
Dale, you and Shawn got the cylinder numbers right I was thinking with my wierd Monday work brain at the time I guess?

[/ QUOTE ]

Wheew... Been there done that. More than I care to mention sometimes too. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Guest]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Dale,

If firing order from front of engine is 1-5-3-6-2-4 you mean the plugs at cylinder numbers 1-5-3 ok and 6-2-4 black?

[/ QUOTE ]

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/nonod.gif The front carb feed cylinders 1-2-3 (the front half of the engine), the rear carb feeds cylinders 4-5-6 (the rear half of the engine). Cylinders numbers are in numeric order in the engine,(1 at the front, 6 at the rear).

Firing order is established at the distributor, as the rotor spins in an anti-clockwise direction. From firing cyl#1 to cyl#5 to cyl#3 to cyl#6 to cyl#2 to cyl#4 then back to cyl#1 as it completes its rotation.

Cylinders #1 and #3 are the only cylinders to match their firing order. Otherwise, cylinder #2 is the fifth (5th) to fire but cylinder #5 is the second (2nd) to fire. Cylinder #4 is the sixth (6th) to fire while cylinder #6 is the fourth (4th) to fire.

If cylinders 4,5&6 are black and sooty though, yes that would indicate a rich mixture from the rear carb.

[/ QUOTE ]

I started having heart palpitations when I read that! Then I tried to extrapolate that into a tri-carb and really got confused.

I had to look at the date then realized that Friday the 13th came on Monday this month.


Bill

 

[Tinster]

Ok, I marked and tagged ALMOST everything
when I extracted the distributor and coil.

But it seems I have two untagged Dan Masters
wires left to install. I am pretty sure they
go onto the new coil somewhere. But I cannot
determine what coil terminals.

I have a heavy gage white wire that comes directly
from Dan's Power Block. Wire diagram says it goes
to coil. Positive or negative terminal?

I have a regular gage yellow/white wire that
originates at the tachometer. It connects to the
coil also.
Pos or neg coil terminal?

Jeffs schlemmer's post was lost. His distributor
red wire goes to coil positive terminal ?
Jeff'd black wire goes to coil terminal negative?

slooooowly things are getting into order.

thanks as always,

Dale

 

[Brosky]

Dale, the Pertronix leads are red and black and are connected to the pos + (red) and the neg - (black) on the coil. I don't know what the Masters harness has to connect, but here is the stock setup with the Pertronix wired in:

 

[DNK]

the yellow wire is not needed in your situation. It is for an electronic tach.I going down to check the wire size for the dist. What does your manual say.

 

[DNK]

The white is a #12 and goes to the coil. + I think.

 

[Tinster]

DNK-

Yes the white is a #12, the MAster's diagrame does not tell + or - terminal.

I would guess + but I don't want to blow up my
new electrical system based upon a wrong guess
on my part.

thanks,

d

 

[danmas]

Dale,

The white wire goes to the positive post of the coil, and the yellow/white wire goes to the negative post and is the input to your tach (assuming you have an aftermarket electronic tach). I assume you have an electronic tach because the white/yellow wire is shipped seperately and is not pre-wired to the panel, so the only reason you would have had it connected would be if you have an electronic tach. We supply wires for aftermarket gauges even for those gauges that are mechanical from the factory just in case the owner wants to upgrade.

 

[Harry_Ward]

Dale you get the instructions with your Dan Masters wire kit?

The following link to the Dan Masters site instruction book has a wiring diagram. White wire goes to positive side of the coil. WB = white/black? goes to points from negative side of coil. Rule of thumb is negative ground cars = negative side of coil gos to points(your car negative side of coil go's to distributor points). Anyway give me some time to trace the tachometer out I don't have a 6 and this is all new to me. The link to Dans instructions are below.

https://www.advanceautowire.com/earlytr6st.pdf

 

[JeffS]

The white wire is the power feed to the coil, so it goes on the + side with the red Pertronix wire! The - side will have only the black wire to the Pertronix.

The rotor should be about centered at the #1 terminal inside the cap at this point. You can leave all three bolts for the distributor clamp just loose enough to turn it by hand with a little force. That way you can still turn it if needed for adjustment, but it won't turn on its own from engine vibrations. You can also turn the rear vacuum moduleto adjust the engine timing. 1 full turn is about a degree. If you loko closely, you will see it has 2 teeth, so pull on it to disengage tht eteeth and turn it for adjustment once you get the timing in the ballpark and tighten down the clamp bolts.
Jeff /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/driving.gif

 

[Brosky]

I have a feeling that we are getting very, very close to seeing the Crypt Car rise again.

 

[Tinster]

Thanks Jeff and Paul !!

Yupper, we are getting closer and closer.

Crazy Mike brought me a mini-propane torch that
is not available here on the island. He showed
me how to solder wire connectors and use flame
shrink tubing to make them look good.

So I spent several hours last night cutting off
all the Dan Masters engine/ignition wire connectors
that previously I could only crimp with that great
British crimping tool.

I added all new terminal connectors, crimped and now
soldered and then covered the ends with that flame-shrink
black tubing.

If the Crypt car refuses to start, at least the wire
terminals will "look good", if nothing else.

I keep wracking my brain to come up with some start-up
related part the Previous Owner has buggered up and I
have somehow missed it.

The only things I can think of that I have not replaced
are the vacuum advance black tubing. Plus the starter
motor that works most of the time.

Plus-I have purchased spares of everything electrical
relating to starting the Crypt Car. Spares of: Coil,
plugs, fuses, wires, rotor, dizzy cap, fuel pump,
points and condenser.

I think we all know the Crypt Car is not going to
give it up on the first attempt and actually start.

I am slowly putting the Crypt Car back together just
in case the engine finally starts. I will need a seat
and a steering wheel to get it over to the auto shop to
begin clutch change out, engine and transmission work, etc.

I can hardly believe how much of this old car I have taken
apart down to individual pieces to refurbish, restore or replace.

I also need to get the car on a lift and re-tighten every
nut and bolt underneath. I had the entire rear end suspension out of the car (several times )during the
past 9 months it's been dead.

enough- off to work now so I can shovel some
more $$ into the bottomless Crypt pit.

d

 

[Tinster]

Thanks Dan and Harry:

I am just a total and complete PUTZ when it
comes to anything electrical in the TR.

Yes, I have the Power Block instructions
yes, I have Dan's Big Yellow Book on wiring
Yes, I have read both several times.

I even had Dan's son Mike here for a week
to sort out the wire mess I made......

and still I have no real understanding of electric
current flow, grounding effect, etc.

For instance, I have barely a clue what this means:

"Rule of thumb is negative ground cars = negative side of coil gos to points(your car negative side of coil go's to distributor points)"

best regards,

dale

 

[Harry_Ward]

Sorry Dale,

After Dan and Jeff posted I realized the force was with you and that I might lead you to the dark side so I let the true wire experts explain it. I would have been tracing wires in my sleep last night. A negative ground car (battery post negative lead bolted to the car body or frame)has the negative side of the coil wire go to the distributor points whereas A positive ground car (battery post positive wire lead is bolted to the car body or frame) has the positive side of the coil wire going to the distributor points. Since you have a negative ground on your car then the negative side of the coil hooks to the distributor points. I should have realized Dan and Jeff would be there for ya and left the confusion to them.

When's the big moment for start up? The weekends coming and I don't want to miss it!

I was thinking you could do a web hook-up and sell tickets.

/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif