Blasphemy Impure Thoughts

[glemon]

I met some guys for my noon basketball lunch workout yesterday and one guy pulls up in a bright yellow late model Toyota MR2 Spyder.

I asked him if he liked the car, and he said yes, then quickly added that it was for sale.

I test drove one once, and it was a hoot, more power (or at least decent power to weight) than I would have thought.

And I thought, is this really what I want in a sports car, light, quick, fun, reliable, carefree?

My first cars were tatty austin healey sprites, they were great fun, just drove em, didn't worry too much about them,if I really wanted to capture some of the fun of a carefree youth would an MR2 or Miata or old Z3 fit the bill better than the restored, relatively fragile, relatively rare TR250?

I say relatively because I am not trying to rag on old LBCs I have had pretty good luck with them, used them as daily drivers for years, but they certainly aren't modern Toyota's or Mazdas in that regard.

I am certainly not ready to pull the plug, LBCs are my lifelong hobby and a chunk of my social life, but it was a much more serious conversation with myself about the issue than I would have suspected.

 

[tdskip]

They are great cars, hard to imagine you'll regret it IF you want that driving experience. Pretty apple vs. orange thing, depends om what fruit tastes best to you.

 

[TR3driver]

Your decision, of course. But after driving a friend's Miata with lots of performance upgrades (including a supercharger); and his Lotus Elise (both of which are awesome cars in their own way) ... I still prefer my "relatively fragile, relatively rare" TR3.

I've only ridden in his Z6 as yet, but I still wouldn't trade my TR for it.

Heard a new one today, in front of Lovelady Hardware, someone asked me if it was an Austin Healey. Turns out he had a 60 Sprite, and the rear end does look kind of like a Sprite on steroids.

 

[TR4nut]

In my club I think we have almost as many 'modern' convertible sports cars as we do LBCs. People still love their little british beasties, but many try to go with modern equivalents as well to have some fun too. And when there's a chance of rain you don't see any Triumphs at our meetings! I was sorely tempted by a Honda S2000 once, but at this point I'm still sticking solely with my TRs.

 

[Guest]

and his Lotus Elise

Which uses the MR2 drivetrain.

See, you can have your cake and eat it too.

I think about a Z3 as well.

 

[mrv8q]

Personally, I've always liked Mister 2s, especially the later (second?) version, which
has more curves than the first, more angular and smaller car. I think the latter cars also came with a supercharged option!

By all means take it for a drive and see what you think!

 

[TR6BobNF]

Hey G:
Know how you feel. I've been driving LBC's off and on and in various states of repair since I was 19 and have to say I'm hooked on the TR6. My neighbor's cherry 1990 Miata runs rings around it but it ain't a Triumph. At Thanksgiving my ex-boss asked me if I'd "mind" taking her triple black 2004 (50,000 mile)Z4 convertible for the weekend, drive it and let her know if it needed any repairs before she put it up for sale. (needed one tire due to a flat on a run-flat with damage; otherwise the car was perfect!)I struggled through the weekend and only put 600 miles on it. What a car compared to the TR6! Smooth, powerful, nice handling, heated seats and a fully functional heating system. Wife loved all that stuff. Brought it back and she asked if I'd "mind" taking the 2005 Honda S2000 for a couple of days and do the same thing. Only put a couple hundred miles on that one. Nice little rocket with exceptional power and handling but not a Z4, at least in my mind. My wife wants me to sell the TR6 and buy the Z4 and ex-boss offered me a steal of a deal but I just can't part with the TR6. I might be persuaded to part with my daily driver Mazda 3 Hatchback, keep the wife's Mazda 6 and buy the Z4 as a daily driver. Wouldn't be too much of a burden to own two sports cars would it? Point is - anybody can have a Z4 but not everybody is capable of owning and maintaining a classic Triumph and it's just got something the BMW doesn't have. Our Sunday tour group is full of Z3's and 4's and Miata's with a couple of Benz roadsters, newer Jags and Porsches but the 2 TR6's, single TR4 and couple of "B"'s get a lot of looks from the crowd. Most of the group don't maintain their late model rides - they just gas them and drive them and they're not really "car guys". You should do whatever turns your crank and if that means parting with the TR, you're only going this way one time so as they say at Targa Newfoundland, "Give 'er"!, loosely translated means go for broke. Go ahead and blaspheme.
Here's how the Z4 looks in my driveway. Looks like it belongs.
Cheers,

 

[glemon]

I don't think I could sell the TR250, but something modern has its appeal. Years ago I had a TR4A and a first generation RX-7, both very different, both very fun.

Funny thing, I am sure I could convince the significant other that it is time to trade in the '99 Maxima for something a little newer and nicer and get something used with reasonable miles for well north of $10K, but if I were to suggest I keep the Maxima and buy a little sports car for something south of $10K and explain we'd be money ahead (over plan A) I suspect it would go over like a lead baloon, maybe I suspect this because such ideas have been floated before with limited success.

I have lots of guys in my club as well with Miatas and such in addition to their LBCs, they all like them both.

Anyway, I don't want to get too far off the Triumph track here, but it is fun to consider the available options. It just struck me how much the idea of the MR2 struck me when it was there staring me in the face.

Maybe when the new Scion FR-S or Subaru BRZ come out, nice and sporty but cozy with some tiny rear seats.

Randall, don't know how many times I have been asked "what kind of MG is that?" when driving a Austin Healey or Triumph, best one was being literally flagged down when driving my (now sadly gone) Healey 100, the guy had one "just like mine" except it was a '59, so I said "was it a six cylinder?" no definitaly a four, a few more questions and I knew he had to have had an MGA, admittedly the lines are similar, but if you owned one you'd think you might remember the name.

 

[TR3driver]

Randall, don't know how many times I have been asked "what kind of MG is that?"

Oh, sure, that happens all the time. I just don't recall being asked if it was a Healey before.

Forgot to mention: my long-term plan is to get rid of the Stags and get a TR8 instead. That's modern enough for me.

 

[TonyPanchot]

In mho and being the owner of an SL, Z3 M and 250 (restored and upgraded with trip Z's)there is no comparison the 250 is serious, radio (still using the factory AM)off fun and the latter I have to take to the shop for service
my 250 makes me think while I drive it as apposed to a couch on wheels !

 

[aeronca65t]

I bought a new Miata about 12 years ago. It's hardly needed a thing over the years and has allowed me to focus on my British sports cars.
I'd say an MR2, Miata, Z3, Solstice, etc, it a nice <span style="font-style: italic">compliment</span> to an LBC.
In my case, the Miata has been the Winter car and my MGB has served and a nice weather/Summer car. I drove them both top-down to work this week.

 

[martx-5]

...
I'd say an MR2, Miata, Z3, Solstice, etc, it a nice <span style="font-style: italic">compliment</span> to an LBC...

Exactly. I have a supercharged '92 Miata with a hardtop that I keep on all the time. I like it as a coupe. If I want to go top down, I take the TR3.

Two very much alike cars, yet so different in character. I like what both of them have to offer. So, it's obvious that you need two sports cars.

 

[Mickey Richaud]

Two very much alike cars, yet so different in character. I like what both of them have to offer. So, it's obvious that you need two sports cars.

Exactly one of the reasons I took on Tony's project MGB GT. But rather than simply restoring it, I'm dropping in a new GM 3.4 V6, 5 speed, and air conditioning. It'll be a nice alternative to the '73 B Tourer that we have.

 

[Anthony_S]

I love my TR3, since the day I saw it in my father in-laws barn I fell in love. Yeah sure newer sports cars are fancy, shiny, fast, ect, ect. But there is just something about the TR that is captivating, mesmerizing and beautiful that I just can't get over. I wouldn't trade it for anything and hope to always have one in the driveway.

 

[Member 10617]

Basically, most people who own vintage sports cars, love touring down back-country roads, top down, wind in the face, the feel of the road -- you know what I mean. Admiring waves and "thumbs-up" signals from others also plays into it. And, then, there is the less tangible feeling of an obligation to preserve what, to many, are works of art on wheels, and making sure they are passed on to future generations. And, while everything works, these cars are fun.

Some of this can be achieved in modern, mostly trouble-free, high performance cars. But, I argue -- and I think I'm preachng to the choir -- the "magic" is not there.

With enough work, care, maintenance, these vintage sports cars can be "almost" as dependable as the modern versions. And this doesn't have to break the bank. New components under the hood can bring them into the XXIst century.

A lot of young people I talk with have the impression that these cars are "money pits" and basically unreliable, so they avoid them. What a shame.

I guess the best solution is to have two sports cars -- one vintage and one new -- but if only one is possible, I vote for the vintage. Life's too short to miss out on them.

 

[PeterK]

Why stop at two if you have the room for onw more? I put in a 4 post lift for storage of the TR3A over my Audi TT.

They both bring a large smiles as well as pucker factor while driving them hard. I hit a corner so hard in the TT that my brother in the passenger seat lost vision from the g-force. Really! He said it was weird but everything went gray for a second.

And the 4A sits on the other side awaiting completion. Slowly.

But the truth of the matter is that since I bought the TT, I have less time to work on the TRs so that's something to consider as well.

 

[Member 10617]

PeterK,

A TR3A over an Audi TT? What about the inevitable oil leaks? At least the roof of your Audi will never rust...

I'm envious of your storage. I have room for only one car. If I had another bay I wouldn't buy a modern sports car, I'd buy an MGTD, or, if I could find one, an MGTF.

 

[PeterK]

PeterK,

A TR3A over an Audi TT? What about the inevitable oil leaks? At least the roof of your Audi will never rust...

I'm envious of your storage. I have room for only one car. If I had another bay I wouldn't buy a modern sports car, I'd buy an MGTD, or, if I could find one, an MGTF.

The oil drips on drip pans between the lift rails, and the TT has a Covercraft Evolution Technalon storage cover. So I'm safe. (I do put a couple of black trash bags over the covered TT just in case)

I am spoiled. We have a two car garage and built the shop for my hobby.

And you're absolutely right about older cars. Modern cars quickly lose their value. My TT was $38K, has 11K miles and books for around $10. I'd by it all day long for $10K. It's a great car, not a great investment.

 

[tr6nitjulius]

Friend owned Bugati motorbike, suped up Baja type VW inpired by my TR6 (owner for 33 yrs over 340K driven miles) he bought Z3 from private owner the honeymoon lasted about a year once he decided to use it to commute unlike Triumph in repair stages that can seemingly nickle dime you to death his maintenance cost soon out did what savings he sought from driving GMC vs Z3 said he loved the performance/ride anticipated the initial costs (payments, smog, insurance) but basic wear & tear maintenance to keep it performing at that high level were far beyond anything he expected, 6 months into owning it due to large repair bills, price of replacement parts and having to take it to shop vs tinkering on it himself he understood why the guy sold it, said his mechanic skills were virtually useless that he'd been better suited were he a computer geek when it came to the Z3 the last 6 months before getting rid of it he referred to it as a money pit. A grand bill on a 40+ year LBC may include major repairs on these newer rides that could be something as simple as oil change, they just don't age well. Higher the nice higher the price!

2006 GF bought brand spankin' new '07 Saturn Sky 4 cylinder 177 hp cruise all day @85 mph vs TR6 6 cylinder 100 hp under ideal conditions cruise all day @70 mph different as night to day compared to my TR only similarity both can go topless/2 seater/around 2300 lbs curb weight/fun to drive. Computer assisted steering/handling/braking/comfort engineering so much easier to drive and performance, forget it, again no comparison but like so many of the others automobiles that have hit the market since the demise of Triumph Marque the lack of tinkerbility and cost of maintenace is issue to be considered not to mention knowing only a few will ever come close to lifespan of a TR did I mention wood dash/chrome bumpers

Last year on a Sunday drive in my TR6*GF in her '07 Saturn Sky hour into drive my TR dies for no apparent reason coasting to side of road, approach her to let her know I'm dead in the water, immediately she pulls out her cell phone, I ask what's that for, her reply to call a tow truck to which I said when our LBCs stop there are several things we check/look at or do, tow truck is not even on our mind until these procedures have been exhausted, half and hour of tinkering (allowed her to cool down, check fuel pump, distributor cap) replaced rotor she fired right up and we continued drive for 3 hrs. Practical Sports Car

Couple months ago she was out & about in her computer assist for darn near everything Saturn Sky codes starting flashing on dash guages, it lost power and coasted to side of road fortunately she was but 3 blocks from home, called tow truck, driver plugged her into some box he had, he said it referenced to fuel pump or water coolant. Though with low power she was able to drive home tow truck followed to make sure she made it. Following week she was able to drive to GM dealership where they hooked the car up to a computer it said the main computer/board ECM needed to be replaced (item had to be ordered) as it had same battery since new I had them R&R a new battery which intaled removing passenger side fender to gain assess which I didn't want anything to do with and knowing a dead/bad battery creates havoc with these modern day automobiles 2 days later she picked up car from dealership. Covered under GM warranty she avoided the $4-500 R&R charge for new ECM R&R/fender/battery was couple hundred. Not very user friendly.

With documented receipts I 've built/rebuilt a $50+ sports car with what I've put into it and what we've been through, where we've driven, times we've had, Peeps we've met I'm one of those select few you couldn't give me any other as a replacement, seemingly with the readiness to tag any vehicle sporty everything that's produced these days are trying to recapture the mystic of LBC there's absolutely nothing like a TR

 

[Member 10617]

Yep! Your gas pump goes out on a TR3. You can replace it roadside, if you have a backup. And the cost is minimal.

Your gas pump goes out on a modern car. Car is towed to shop, gas tank removed, gas pump removed (probably not repaired), gas tank replaced. Out hundreds of dollars.

Air bag in a modern car goes bad. Entire thing has to be replaced (been there, done that). Out hundreds of dollars.

Computers go out.... hundreds of dollars.

There is only one computer in my TR3A.... and it is on the watchband on my wrist.

Don't get me wrong. Airbags, computers, etc. are wonderful things... saves lives.... but can be a real money pit.